Epic Tolkien Bookclub: Week Seven

[sigridhr]

   Epic Tolkien Bookclub: Week Seven (The Hobbit)
Chapter XIII: Not at Home
Chapter XIV: Fire and Water

Rules

I very much doubt we'll require much in the way of formal rules, but just for the sake of formality and clarity:

• Discussion is welcome and encouraged, as is disagreement. Name-calling and personal attacks will be punished by forcing you to mediate at Christmas dinner in the house of Finwë. 
  
• There is no spoiler policy in place. Although we're reading the Hobbit, please feel free to bring in things from other Tolkien works, any of the films, the History of Middle Earth, the Letters of JRR Tolkien, and, if you should like, other literary sources. 
• There is no such thing as too much geekery. Or taking the text too seriously.  
• If you have any concerns at any point, I'm the closest thing this gong show has to a mod, so feel free to get in touch. I can be reached either by PM through this site, or directly by email at sigridhr.lokidottir@gmail.com. 

Discussion on this post will officially run from Friday 22nd February 2013 to Friday 1st March 2013. However, the post will remain open after that point, so you're more than welcome to continue discussions on.

Comments

[gallifaerie.livejournal.com]

Just when the dwarves were most despairing, Bilbo felt a strange lightening of the heart

I just love this at the start of Chapter 13. To me, it just emphasises why Bilbo is there and why he is the perfect addition to the party. He is realistic and sensible when the dwarves are overly-excited, yet when they're despairing, he is optimistic and encourages them not to give up. He's like the yin to their yang, balancing out their group. They would just be lost without him.

And you see this again later in the chapter:

Bilbo kept his head more clear of the bewitchment of the hoard than the dwarves did

I feel that there are parallels between Bilbo finding the Arkenstone and him finding the ring - he's drawn to the Arkenstone and pockets it right away without telling the dwarves, even though he knows he should. I still don't understand why he didn’t he tell Thorin right away.

SO MUCH Balin love though:

"It is about our turn to help," said Balin, "and I am quite willing to go."

I never realised until this reread how sweet Balin is. He has such a soft spot for Bilbo. I feel like all the other dwarves are often like ‘let Bilbo do it whatevs’ but Balin actually cares about him and how much he’s doing to help them.

I wish we got more of a description of Thorin’s reaction to returning to Erebor – especially with it all being in ruin, and with "skulls and bones" in Thror's great chamber. I feel like that's kind of glossed over here, but I'm hoping we’ll get more of that in the movie.

When they reach the outlook post:

"Hear, hear!" cried Bilbo, and flung himself on the ground.

omg Bilbo I love you. That is the *proper* hero's reaction to a day of stressful events in my book.

I love the eerie image of Smaug’s carcass rotting on the bed of the lake. It's just so gruesome!

[starliings.livejournal.com]

That's interesting, about the parallels between Bilbo finding the ring and the stone. I kinda think that the fact that Bilbo is generally unimpressed with adventures and stuff is the whole reason he was so useful to the dwarves, even though they might not have realised it. He's like their antithesis really, he's not really bothered about the gold or ~revenge~ or anything so he doesn't get so kind of possessed by the gold in the end. He just wants to get home (/hugs Bilbo forever)

Also I love the bit describing Smaug coming towards the village, it's so scary! I'm guessing that's gonna be a pretty epic bit to see on the big screen.

[gallifaerie.livejournal.com]

You're right, Bilbo's motivation is really different from the dwarves, so he reacts in different ways to them, and that's what makes him so indisposable.

so he doesn't get so kind of possessed by the gold in the end
That's really interesting, because he has the ring, and after having it for fifty years, it does have some effect on him, but the dwarves' treasure doesn't. I tend to see the ring as a symbolism of all greed, so maybe that's why Bilbo, or hobbits in general are much better at resisting the effects of the ring - because they're really tolerant to developing those kind of unhealthy obsessions with objects and money.

I really can't wait to see Smaug in the movie! I think Peter Jackson said they were trying to make him the most impressive movie dragon ever, so I'm expecting a lot. Also: BENEDICT CUMBERBATCH, so what's not to like?

[sigridhr]

Lovely point about Bilbo contrasting with the dwarves.

And seconding a wish we got more of Thorin's reaction - or, really, Thorin's thought process in general. We barely get anything about him, really.

[gallifaerie.livejournal.com]

I already feel that I know Thorin so much better as a character since watching the movie, for which I have the scriptwriters, Peter Jackson and Richard Armitage to thank I'm sure. Not to mention fanfiction from Thorin's POV too! It does often feel lacking in the book.

[j_quadrifrons]

I was so sick last week I completely forgot a whole week had passed and it was time for another discussion post!

While I am separated from my notes, I can bring up my Second Creeping Silmarillion Theory, which is actually glaringly obvious once you think of it: Suppose that the Arkenstone is a Silmaril.

It's not out of the question. Maedhros threw himself into a chasm and his silmaril came to rest "beneath the earth" and, some time later, the Dwarves dug it up. And, well, it goes back to rest beneath the earth - in point of fact it never really leaves, except for a short trip out to Thranduil and Bard.

The thing that really made me think of this - that makes me think that this was a thing that Tolkien actually did when he was writing The Hobbit, although he later stated that, in the grander scheme of things, the Arkenstone was *not* meant to be a silmaril - is the fact that when Tolkien translated some of his stories into Anglo-Saxon --

I'm sorry. I have to stop there. When TOLKIEN translated some of his OWN STORIES into FUCKING ANGLO-SAXON for NO REASON other than that he is a GIGANTIC NERD oh my GOD

he used the word "eorclanstánas," singular "eorclan-stan," ("precious stone") to refer to the silmarils, which is also pretty obviously the word that "Arkenstone" derives from.

I'm not sure this theory does anything in the long run except kind of explain some of the insanity that goes on around the Arkenstone (fairly minor, compared to some of the insanity that had gone on around the silmarils before), and make for some truly hilarious moments later on when Bilbo uses it as a pillow. But, well, hobbits.

[sigridhr]

Oh, bless. No matter how hard we fangirl, we'll never out-nerd Tolkien.

If I headcanon that it is a Silmaril, Bilbo using it as a pillow will be my second-favourite Silmaril moment, after the glorious mental image of Earendil tying it to his head.